My first training project.
Every thing is going great he is a smart horse.
The one thing I can't seem to get is he clock wise circles fantastic counter clock wise but clock wise circle he falls out or inn.
I tried twirling the rein this usually gets me end up in the middle of the circle. LOL
I put my leg on he is not moving of it.
seems a ballance issue?

Any suggestions are exercises i can try.

Thanks
A

I'm not sure I understood the question completely, but if you are trying to canter to the right but he can't stay in it or do it smooth and even, are you sure he's on the right lead?

How many rides/hours on this horse so far? What are you riding in; i.e snaffle mecate, etc. What do you mean by "twirling the rein"?

When a horse tries to circle smaller than I want (drop the inside shoulder and duck in), it's usually when they get their nose to the outside of the circle. If it happens to the extreme, you'll find yourself hat-brim up and haulin' the mail.
Assuming I'm riding in a snaffle & mecate, I pick up my inside rein, and keep my outside rein hand lower, then lay the inside rein in against the neck. What I'm doing is trying to set up a barrier of sorts to keep the circle shaped the way I want it. I'll apply leg pressure to move the horse to the outside, and if the horse doesn't give to the pressure, the pressure increases until he starts to widen the circle. Be careful you aren't bumping constantly with your legs, or soon your legs don't mean anything. With your inside rein up, you want to see just a little of that inside eye to keep your circle shaped right. Just regular little "checks" with the rein should keep the nose inside for you. Your "inside rein up" is where you'll eventually start to get your soft feel.
Another problem is when the rider starts looking to the inside more and more, or down at your horse's head, and sure enough the horse goes right where you are looking. Even in an arena we try to ride "heads up and find your cows". It seems to help.
Maybe these points will trigger something that will help you. We have a couple of horses that travel better one way than the other, I try to not make a big deal of it most of the time, just little corrections here and there. Good luck.

[ February 07, 2008, 01:10 PM: Message edited by: ranchroper ]

Thank you I will give that a try its the only thing I can't seem to find small improvements on.
He does it in the loop as well as the trot so i been focusing on trotting circles untill he gets that inplace before asking him to lope.

Thanks again for your input.

This guy i have is 3 months under saddle
I use a snaffle bit sometimes a mecate sometimes heavy leather reigns.
I swinging the end of the reign in a swirlling motion on the side he is falling in my only problem is the response is bigger than what i am hoping for. Ranchroper what do you mean with drop the inside shoulder and duck in is this bending his to the iside?

We have a mare that was doing that for awhile. At the jog she was pretty good and it was easy to make the circles the shape I wanted. But at the lope she would get her nose to the outside and you could feel the inside shoulder start to lower and at that point you start to lose control (i.e. no brakes) & the circle gets lopsided or smaller. If you keep the nose tipped into the circle slightly you'll avoid that and he'll travel better for you. Personally I wouldn't get in the habit of flicking or twirling my rein at him, chances are while you are concentrating on that you quit riding your horse. Try to ride thru the problem and work on leg pressure applied at the right time. You want your horse to always work from a pressure and release frame of mind, in my opinion. That applies to everything we do with them I think.
I would also get everything correct at the trot before I loped him if I were you. If it's not working well at the trot, loping compounds everything. Have fun and don't sweat the small stuff.
ps... some days are gonna go better than others. That's just life. Look for some small successes and don't be afraid to call it a day when things aren't working. Don't forget he's trying to figure you out too.
pss...I'm no expert and don't pretend to be a horse trainer, this is just what I do with my horses.

[ February 07, 2008, 02:53 PM: Message edited by: ranchroper ]

One thing hasn't been mentioned is rider position on the horse. I know when I was riding circles, particularly at the lope, Rusty would "break down" from lope to trot, until my coach told me I was dropping my inside shoulder, which in turn shifted my weight in the saddle, and Rusty would drop his shoulder, thus causing the breakdown.
The same thing can occur when riding your fifteen-foot, twenty-foot circles - the smaller the circle, the more conscious of your riding position you have to be. As someone once told me in all of this, "When something goes wrong, people always tend to go back to the horse, when they should be going back to the rider...." I've found this to be so true. Not to say this is the case in this situation, but it could be part of the cause.
Ranchroper is right too in position of the nose - perhaps those two in combination might help improve your trotting/loping circles for you.
I also agree with her twirling the reins could be counter-productive in perhaps affecting your riding position, and your horse is over-correcting. My suggestion is a combination of riding position, tilting that nose to the outside as RR suggested, and not twirling that rein.